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spilleddi
12-18-2007, 01:47 AM
All right, I'm starting with the easy stuff.

Numbers 1-20

1 nóoñsaa
2 nóoñbaa
3 láani
4 dóoba
5 gisáañha
6 agáasbee
7 saagóomiiñ
8 baláani
9 kasáñhga
10 búujga
11 aginooñsaa
12 aginooñbaa
13 agilaani
14 agidooba
15 agigiisáañha
16 agiagaasbe
17 agisagoomiñ
18 agibalaani
19 agikasáñhga
20 bújga nooñbaa

spilleddi
12-21-2007, 12:44 AM
Basic phrases. Some of these phrases date back to fort Christanna, so are somewhat ill defined

aháñ or awaaxa -- yes

ihaao or yaháñ -- no

biiláhug -- thank you

mekoolemechin -- You are very welcome

jog de log -- How do you do?

biiwa -- nice, good, thank you (thanks)

kéekoñg -- I will (OK)

keekóñg añháñ alewáyo -- In everything you are right

hañháñ gidaaya kekoñkaléwaya -- Surely, everything is alright

owagihniwañ -- fill out if possible

kenepaskiniwiki -- my service to you Queen (“Queen” can mean a woman leader, or any high
ranking or respected woman)

ke li pomelin -- Will you kiss me?

Linda
12-22-2007, 09:36 AM
kéekoñg -- I will (OK)

keekóñg añháñ alewáyo -- In everything you are right


How does that second phrase translate? It looks like keekóñg means 'I will' and añháñ means 'yes' so how do those two combine with alewáyo into 'in everything you are right?

spilleddi
12-23-2007, 07:43 PM
I should point out that the phrases translated as "I will", "in everything you are right", "surely everything is all right", and "fill out if possible" are untranslatable. The English translations are written the way they were originally written down.

The phrase "fill out if possible" is confusing. I'm guessing it either means to fill out or fill up a sack of something completely, or to place one's mark on a document. Anyone have any other guesses? It dates from 1888.

The people who collected these phrases had to go through interpreters from English to Cayuga to Tutelo and back. These were also recorded from semifluent speakers. When a language is dying, the last speakers generally simplify phrases and change meanings.

Also, the phrases translated as "you are very welcome", "how do you do", "my service to you Queen". "will you kiss me", are all attributed to the Indians of Fort Christanna, but they may be of Powhatan or Iroquoian origin. The word list from Fort Christanna shows a mix of eastern Siouan words with these other two language families. That would be expected in the case were people from different tribes are thrown together on a reservation. I included these phrases because regardless of the language of origin, they were used by our ancestors at Fort Christanna.

I find it interesting that of the 46 words and phrases from Fort Christanna, Fontaine found it neccesary to write the translations for "my dear wife", "come to bed", and "will you kiss me". Think hes one of our ancestors?

Linda
12-23-2007, 09:00 PM
Sounds as bad as William Byrd, who wrote about how hard he was trying to look up our ladies' (mini) skirts, but they were always careful not to show him a thing.

spilleddi
12-28-2007, 01:21 AM
This language is best described as Tutelo-Saponi, since there are a number of Saponi words also used. Many Saponi words come from Fort Christanna. Note that some words, such as “hat” has several Indian words, and another word, ”wig” has an “f” sound.

I’m also experimenting with different ways of posting the material, let me know if a certain post is easier or harder to understand.

Tutelo clothing words

HAT -- kotubús, lubúus

POCKET -- isdagoniñ

SHOES, RUNNING SHOES -- hañdisanooi (This word can be used for modern running shoes)

Words from Fort Christanna

BREECHES, PANTS -- lonoode (Saponi)

COAT -- opoghe (Saponi)

HANKERCHIEF -- mihañsá

HAT -- apatu bogso (Saponi)

SHIRT -- opoghe hasa (Saponi)

SHOE, MOCCASIN, INDIAN SHOE -- aañgoohlee, magasoñs (Saponi)

SILVER ARMLET, BRACELET -- gaagsagiiñnakóoñ

STOCKING -- honis (Saponi)

WIG -- magneto dufas (Saponi)

beeleaf
12-28-2007, 04:18 PM
Thank you!

Magneto dufas sounds like a character from X-Men.
;~)

fromOntario
12-30-2007, 07:50 PM
Thanks for all your hard work! wow! That's GREAT!
I hope to be in touch in new year!
Deb :)
PS Did you get the book?

spilleddi
01-01-2008, 03:24 AM
Glad you like the words. Deb, were you asking if I got the Tutelo books from 6 nations? I got the one on the naming ceremony, but not the other one yet. Right now I’m looking for some specific grammar books for other Siouan languages.

Some English words have more than one Tutelo translation. I’m writing the oldest known words first, and if theres more than one word recorded in the same year, then I write the shortest word first. I forgot to mention earlier, that unless otherwise stated, all these words are out of Oliverio. Words in parenthesis are my own interpretations of words or comments. Also, the “w” can change to an “m” in some words under certain circumstances, like in the Tutelo words for bread and pig. “W” is the older sound.

Berry -- hasi

Bread -- wagesaagwaai, wáagsaagbáa

Cherry -- yosañglota

Corn -- maañdaaxée

Cow, any bovine, (beef) -- mañpa

Cranberry - hohinañg

Egg -- poos

Food -- waluuti

Pepper -- béebahé

Pig, (pork) -- waañsgoolóo

Powder, flour -- waabahé

Pumpkin -- mañdamaiñ

Raspberry -- hasisiaa

Salt -- hagúchigooñyooñ, machigóoyoñ

Soup -- wagsagsí, woohé

Squash -- mañdamaiñ yiliip (this is one word)

Strawberry -- hasbahínañg

Sugar -- waadeewíi

Some food phrases
Eat Bread! Come To Dinner! -- walút magsabaa (walút wáagsaagbáa)
(this can be used to call folks to any meal, and can mean Time To Eat! or Come And Get It!.

Take Some Soup -- walút wagsagsí (this basically means Soups On!, Time To Eat Soup!)

These words are from a word list from Speck
Come eat -- walút

Cow, beef -- mañmpá ‘e (probably pronounced mañpá 'e)

Cow’s milk -- mañmpá ‘íye (mañpá ‘íye)

Pork rib -- maskoló gwayútik (waañsgoolóo gwayútik)

spilleddi
01-03-2008, 12:05 AM
Tutelo-Saponi critters

Black bear -- yúudgayéek

Bear -- mooñdi, hamóoñti

Beaver -- yáaba, chutaayi, munaaxga

Bird -- maañyiiñgi

Bird’s nest -- maañyiiñgiyéxda

Bison, Buffalo -- iaap

Buffalo -- mañpañdahgaa (this means wild cow)

Buck -- babóosgoñ, chinóñkehe

Buzzard -- hika

Cat (domestic cat) -- buus (probably from English pussy cat)

Cat (any cat) -- dalúsgik (Iroquoian)

Colt -- chooñgidaañyiñg

Cow -- máhdiyíiñ

Cow, any bovine -- mañpa

Cow, Ox -- maañpayíñg

Crane -- kaiñsdaakai

Crow -- kaaxi

Deer -- witáa

Dog -- chóoñgi, chooñti

Duck -- heeisdáañ, iisdai

Fawn -- héegeloñsgá

Fish -- wihóo, bisooká

Fox -- dooxgaa

Frog -- héewooñ

Game bird -- mañ

Goose, Duck -- mañneeasaañ

Horse -- chooñgidáñ

Muskrat -- dayañsgá

Nest -- yéxda

Otter -- mosnughe

Partridge -- wusdedgai

Pheasant -- mañsdedgaí

Pig, Hog -- waañsgoolóo

Pidgeon -- waayuudgáa, wayáasoñdga

Rabbit -- tañyooñyaha

Raccoon -- miga, kanulóoñ nixa niisóñ

Raccoon, fox -- wihá

Rattlesnake -- hañdooi

Snake -- moka (Saponi), waagenii

Squirrel -- nisdaaxgai, hisdaaxgai

Turkey -- maañdaahgaa

Turkey Beard -- mañosdi

Wolf -- mañgdooxgaa, mañgdagíñ, choñgíiwe

spilleddi
01-03-2008, 10:31 PM
Plants

Bark -- xaapi, yohíñ

Grass -- soñgdaagi, mugdaagi

Hawthorn -- ho

Leaf, grass, green -- odoo

Oak -- taasgahooi

Pine tree -- waasdii

Root -- wayugáñ

Tree -- onii, maxhíga

Tree, Wood, Log, Branch -- wiiyáñ

Tobacco -- noñníi

spilleddi
01-03-2008, 10:37 PM
Place names- I don’t know exactly were these places are, somewhere from Tutelo and Saponi traditional territory in NC, VA. "Manii" means water.

Beaver Creek -- Yabadogo

Hyco River, Hycootee River -- Hikaadmanii (turkey buzzard river)

Jumping Creek, Fishing Creek -- Ohiñbamanii (Saponi)

Paint Creek -- Mañsamanii

Tuscarooda Creek -- Dewahomanii (Saponi for ‘died in water’) Named for when a Tuscarora Indian was killed and his body thrown into the creek.

spilleddi
01-05-2008, 02:47 AM
Abdomen -- seemañta

Arm -- hisdóo

Beard -- isdii, yeehii, isdihiooi

Blood -- wáayii

Body -- yuu, yuuxdéki, yuuxdeehi, yuuxdeli

Bone -- waahuu

Brain -- wasuuti

Breast -- masa

Cheek -- agsdáñ

Ear -- naxuux

Elbow -- isiba

Eye -- dasuu

Face -- té, taluubna, taluugena

Fingernail -- chuchaagi

Flesh -- waayuuxdéki

Foot -- isii

Forehead -- tikooi, pania te

Hair - hii, nañtóoñ

Hand, Finger -- háagi

Head -- pa, pasuu

Heart -- yaañdi, daabii

Index finger -- haag abuusgañ

Leg -- yegsaa, nii

Lip -- iisdabi, iisdablugsiik

Little finger -- haag iiñs

Middle finger -- haag ayaañdohlañ

Mouth, tooth -- ihii

Neck -- taseei

Nose -- paaxdii

Pupal -- suu

Tail -- soñd

Throat -- looti

Thumb -- haakoohgaa

Toe -- adgasusai

Tongue -- leechii, neechii

daniel_bingamon
01-05-2008, 02:49 PM
So, 'agin' is like 'ake' in Lakota, in english it's translate as 'plus'

If so, bújga nooñbaa aginooñsaa = 21?




11 aginooñsaa
12 aginooñbaa
13 agilaani
14 agidooba
15 agigiisáañha
16 agiagaasbe
17 agisagoomiñ
18 agibalaani
19 agikasáñhga
20 bújga nooñbaa

spilleddi
01-05-2008, 10:54 PM
So, 'agin' is like 'ake' in Lakota, in english it's translate as 'plus'

If so, bújga nooñbaa aginooñsaa = 21?

I appreciate any comments, questions, or corrections, especially from you folks that have experience with a Siouan language. I have worked with native languages from several different language families, but Tutelo is my first Siouan one, so I am unfamiliar with the grammar.

“agi” in Tutelo means “being on”.

11 -- aginooñsaa “one being on” The word for 10 has been omitted.

21 -- bújga nooñbaa aginooñsaa “one being on 20”

22 -- bújga nooñbaa aginooñba “two being on 20”

Heres some more numbers
30 -- bújga laani

40 -- bújga dooba

Hundred -- ukiníi

One hundred -- ukinii nooñsaa

101 -- ukinii nooñsaa nooñsaa “hundred one one”

111 -- ukinii nooñsaa aginooñsaa “hundred one one being on ten ”

Two hundred -- ukinii nooñbaa

Thousand -- ukinii bujga

One thousand -- ukinii bujga nooñsaa

1001 -- ukinii bujga nooñsaa aginooñsaa “one being on one thousand”

Once -- enoñx

Ordinal numbers
First -- etaahni

For numbers besides one, add “iñ” to the beginning of numbers

Second -- iñnooñbaa

Third -- iñlaani

Fourth -- iñdooba

spilleddi
01-05-2008, 11:01 PM
Weather

Autumn -- táañi

Bad weather -- nahañb okayiiki

Cloud -- maxoosii

Fog -- manotihuua, mahaukiiwah

Ice, hail -- nóoñxi

Icey -- noñxluba, miiñgilaachah, aasadnidguáñx

Lightning -- tabuniijgai

Rain -- xaawoo, xaawoohaa

Sheet lightning -- kopaagsegseei

Snow -- hohii, hohihoo

Spring -- masdée, wehaéhiñbnee

Summer -- weehee biiwa

Thunder -- tuuhi, tuuhaañgluu

Wind -- mañglée, maniañglée, mamañglée

Winter -- waanáañ

spilleddi
01-06-2008, 12:28 AM
Ford -- manisaab

Forest -- daaxgaa

Hill, mountain -- heegi, súuxi, oheegi

Island -- sdéeki

Islands -- sdesdéeki

Land, earth, world -- amáañ

Prairie -- lataahgoi

River -- dagsiisañ

River, bank -- mañiñgde

River, stream -- daagsee

Sea, lake -- yeedáañ

Spring (small river) -- hisdíñ

Stone, rock, island -- hisdéeki, nisdéeki

Swamp, bog -- hooix

Water -- manii

Sky, heaven -- maañdóoñ

Sun -- miiñ

Moon – miiñmahée (sun woman), miiñnoosáa (sun night)

Star -- tabuníiñteka

daniel_bingamon
01-06-2008, 02:00 PM
So, 132 = ukinii nooñsaa bújga laani aginooñba ?
That's a mouthfull!


English -- Tutelo -- Lakota
Dog -- chóoñgi, chooñti -- Sunka (note: s pronounced as sh)

Between Tutelo and Lakota when pronounced you can notice the remote similarity
I'm only using Lakota because I have a little familiarity with it - I'm sure other Siouan languages are closer.

BTW - I saw this (listed as Saponi/Tutelo) at an online North Carolina Museum website:
Making (Ongoing Action)
I am making – Móma
S/He is making – O’ma
You are making – Yóma
Made (Past)
I made – Móka
S/He made – O’ka
You made – Yóka
Will Make (Future)
I will make – Móta
S/He will make – O’ta
You will make – Yóta

This is similar to a Lakota word, okaga - to create, copy, model. What is interesting is the amount of changes in the consonants when the word is conjugated in past, present (participle), future forms.

.

spilleddi
01-07-2008, 01:15 AM
So, 132 = ukinii nooñsaa bújga laani aginooñba ?
That's a mouthfull!
Correct, although you could also say ukinii noos bújga laali aginooñbaa

Tutelo has a number of complex sound changes. The words I have been posting so far are the standard forms. These sound change rules are not always followed. I eventually plan on typing up a more detailed explanation on the pronunciation thread.

‘l’ can become ‘n’ usually before a nasal vowel

'n' can become 'd'

’j’ can become ’s’ before ‘g’

Unstressed short vowels can be dropped, especially at the end of the word. Mostly ‘i’, less often ‘e’, sometimes ’a’, rarely ‘u’.

Heres alternate pronunciations for numbers. It would make sense to use the shorter versions for longer numbers.
1 -- nóos, nóoñs

2 -- nóoñb

3 -- náani, náan, láan, láali, láat

4 -- dóob

5 -- gisáañ

6 -- agáas

7 -- saagóom

8 -- baláan, baláali

9 -- sáa, sáañ, ksáañ, ksáañg, ksáaga

10 -- búudsg, búudsga

13 -- agilaali

16 -- agigaasbe

18 -- agibalaali

19 -- agiksaañga

30 -- bújga laali

Check the verb thread for an explanation of the verb ’to make’.

sammarroq
01-07-2008, 05:50 PM
All I can say is WOW! This is wonderful, thanks Spilleddi.

Shirley

DAJ42
01-07-2008, 09:09 PM
Aye, many thanks Spilleddi. Good work.

spilleddi
01-08-2008, 02:34 AM
Glad you guys like this stuff. Hope its helpful, posting word lists is the easy part. Theres about 800 words in the Tutelo-Saponi dictionary if I remember correctly. I'm posting these words how they appear in the dictionary, stay tuned to the pronunciation thread when I figure out how the sounds can change.

Darkness -- ohsíiha

Day -- naháañbi

Evening -- ohsiihite

Light, daylight, moonlight -- obláada

Morning -- ganahaañbnañ

Night -- ohsii

Now -- ohíñ (an interjection, related to Biloxi word for ‘well!’)

Today -- naháñblekíñ

Tomorrow -- naháañbgi

Yesterday -- sidóoñlé

Counting days Notice that the final ‘i’ disappears when making a compound word.
One day -- naháañb nóoñsaa

Two days -- naháañb nóoñbaa

Three days -- naháañb láani

spilleddi
01-09-2008, 12:24 AM
Arrow -- mañgsíi, maañkooi

Axe, hatchet -- hiséepi, niséepi

Bow -- hinóosii

Club -- yeheeti

Gun -- miiñgdée

Knife -- maañsáañ

Powder -- mahiñgd (Saponi)

Powder horn -- dabike (Saponi)

Shot -- mañkii (Saponi)

Shot bag -- miñgdoke (Saponi)

Sword -- iñpoo (Saponi)

Linda
01-09-2008, 10:58 PM
I want to illustrate the vocabulary that's being developed with free clip-art. I could use help amassing some of these images. We need images of things like body parts, so you can see the word for ear alongside a picture of an ear, and there will also be a sound recording of the word pronounced. If anybody thinks they can help with this project, but contact me, sissipaha@saponitown.com.

spilleddi
01-10-2008, 01:55 AM
Ash -- alapook

Bag -- mañgsuui

Basket, container -- pahiñ

Bead -- watai

Bed -- saasi

Blanket -- mixhaíñhod

Book, paper written on -- mináagi

Box -- okú

Chair -- íyanañgóiñ

Churn -- mañpamasawohooka (where cows milk is mixed)

Door -- idoogáya

Fire -- péeti, miihañstíik

House -- atíi

Kettle -- yesíiñk

Paper, blank paper -- hihnéta

Pipe (for smoking) -- yihíiñsdig, gjiñbáai

String, cord -- waxúu

Vessel, jug, jar, glass, bottle, kettle -- iigaatee’óoñ

Wooden spoon -- gisáa

spilleddi
01-10-2008, 02:01 AM
Adoption string -- kanogwíya

Bad, evil -- isii

Corpse -- kayuke

Devil -- papasik

Devil, evil spirit, bad spirit -- maañpaa isii

Evil spirit -- isiika

False face, mask -- wahugmíi

Ghost of deceased -- wanañchii

God -- eiiñga

Great spirit, god -- eeíñgiyáñ

Longhouse -- atíi sui

Spirit -- maañpaa

spilleddi
01-11-2008, 02:12 AM
Ball -- daabi

Board -- hañnikaháap

Bushel -- henóñsañ

Canoe, boat -- laháapi

Copper -- benihéei

Hole -- kohóche

Hoof, horn -- hée

Hoop, mound -- basahé

Iron -- maañs

Lacrosse stick -- yañhée

Pile -- salédise

Road, path -- hañdgóx

Seed -- suu

Shorts in grinding corn (I have no idea what this means) -- waasagsé

Stick -- hañgsí, wañjék, ógnasí

Town, village -- maañbii

Yellow object -- waasi

spilleddi
06-01-2008, 02:16 PM
Father -- -áadi

How you address your own father -- daadi

Cousin -- hadág

My cousin -- wañgiidá, mañgiidá

Son -- -háñke

Step-son -- -hañxgihiyé

Mother -- -hooñnii

How you address your own mother -- hiináañ

Brother (elder or younger) -- iñginóoñbaa

Step-child -- -gihiyé

Grandmother, grandfather -- -gooñ

Grandfather -- -dokáñx, goñkág

Uncle, mother’s brother -- -néeg

Younger brother -- -noona

Elder sister -- -noñx

Daughter, daughter-in-law -- -oháañke

Step-daughter -- -ohañxgihiyé

Brother, elder brother, younger brother -- -oginóoñba

Younger brother -- -sóñdga

Younger sister -- -dahañk

Brother-in-law -- -tahañni

Woman’s elder brother -- -tal

Elder brother -- -táñsg

Child, daughter, son -- -déeka

Step-son, step-daughter -- -dekagihiyé

Aunt, father’s sister -- tomiiñ

Niece -- -dosing

Nephew -- -dósga

Father-in-law, mother-in-law -- -doñd

Man’s elder brother -- -wahiyig

Aunt -- watemai

Sister -- wineeg

spilleddi
06-01-2008, 03:07 PM
Chief -- dikáhgu, eegowee

Warrior -- eelutaaoñe

Running man -- hañdáñhe

Child -- niisgá, hóñsga, móñsga

Child, infant -- guujgaa, waagasíig, waaguujgaa

Woman -- mahée, waalewáa

Man, to be a man -- máwaháa (this is a noun and a verb, to say “I am a man”, its mámiwaháa)

Female, woman, wife, girl -- miháañ

Monitan -- monitañ

Nahyssan -- nahisañ

Dizzy man -- niháñjgahañg, daháñjgihaañg

Dizzy woman -- niyaguujgahañg

Male, man -- noona

Long line of men -- paxdakóñse

Boy -- waitiwa

Boy, man -- waaiyuúwaa

Man acting by command -- waki

Man, Indian -- waagdáagaa

Handsome girl -- waaguujgañhañg

Man -- waiwaax, miháañisdíg

Whiteman -- waañhganáñhga, miñhañ waañhganáñhga

Black man -- waañhganañhgaasít, waañhganañhgesúp

Man, husband -- waañhgi

Friend -- xée, xaa

Tutelo people -- yesáñ

spilleddi
02-06-2009, 12:41 AM
I found two more Tutelo-Saponi words in the Handbook of North American Indians, vol 14, p.294

Hoonskey, chief, and hoosky incha, female chief, or 'queen'.

'The Virginians called the chiefs of the Saponi, Tutelo, and Occaneechi hoonskey, supposedly the native term for chief (but which is not found in recorded vocabularies), while the leader of the Stukanox was a woman, called hoosky incha, meaning 'queen'."

Looks like they would be pronounced hóoñski and hóoñski iñcha.

magnolia
02-10-2011, 01:51 PM
Hello All,

I'm very neglectful this year.

I found an amazing amount of Indian data on Deborah Iseminger's Family Tree
( Genealogy site. ) Surnames like 'Price' and her descent from 'Wat Bailey 'of the Nottoways.
Also, an English-Nottoway Dictionary. and a 1677 Treaty with actual signed symbols ( signatures of ' Queen Pomunckey' and her son ,' Capt John West 'and ' Mastegonoe of the
Sappones.' Her page " Cheroenhaka is very nice.

Suncerae
04-13-2011, 08:29 AM
It would be really great if we could hear how the words are pronounced. I've been trying but have butchered the words.



I should point out that the phrases translated as "I will", "in everything you are right", "surely everything is all right", and "fill out if possible" are untranslatable. The English translations are written the way they were originally written down.

The phrase "fill out if possible" is confusing. I'm guessing it either means to fill out or fill up a sack of something completely, or to place one's mark on a document. Anyone have any other guesses? It dates from 1888.

The people who collected these phrases had to go through interpreters from English to Cayuga to Tutelo and back. These were also recorded from semifluent speakers. When a language is dying, the last speakers generally simplify phrases and change meanings.

Also, the phrases translated as "you are very welcome", "how do you do", "my service to you Queen". "will you kiss me", are all attributed to the Indians of Fort Christanna, but they may be of Powhatan or Iroquoian origin. The word list from Fort Christanna shows a mix of eastern Siouan words with these other two language families. That would be expected in the case were people from different tribes are thrown together on a reservation. I included these phrases because regardless of the language of origin, they were used by our ancestors at Fort Christanna.

I find it interesting that of the 46 words and phrases from Fort Christanna, Fontaine found it neccesary to write the translations for "my dear wife", "come to bed", and "will you kiss me". Think hes one of our ancestors?

Linda
04-13-2011, 12:46 PM
We have sound files up here, http://saponitown.com/tutelo. Not all the words/phrases here have been brought over there yet, but it should get you started.

Suncerae
04-14-2011, 12:13 PM
WOW! Thanks!:o